Utilities at 31%

[Palmyra Jim]

I have seen elsewhere the utilities are high above 25%. At 31%, where can I look for immediate improvements? I would need to get the monthly bills down by $1200.00 to equal 25%.

Can old equipment be tuned up, cleaned and made more efficient? I know keeping the flues clean will help the driers, turning the boiler down a few degrees, checking for valves that remain open when the wash is finished.....any other components to check.

The dryers are Continentals(7 yrs old) and SQs (15+ years old).
Washing Machines are HUebsch (5 yrs. old), Maytags ( 12+ years old), Wascomats 12 yrs old with another group at 14+.

The heaters with holding tanks are 15+ years old. There are two 650 btu heaters that I will look at today.
Jim

[William]

The simpliest way to lower utilities percentage of gross is to raise prices.

[KJD]

William beat me to it... Care to share your current vend prices for us to look at, maybe they are to low.

[pete f]

Yes, the answer is right in front of you. To make a more profitable mat, the water vs washer income ratio and gas costs vs dryer income ratios should be watched, and adjusted (prices) from time to time.

[Palmyra Jim]

I looked at the boilers yesterday. I agree raising prices would be the easiest way to go. I will check prices at the laundromats that are 5 miles in either direction to see what they are charging.

Does anyone know of an "instant heater" to avoid storing large quantities of water during slow periods? I know they sell them for homes and for restaurants that use quite a bit of water?

[pete f]

I have instant heaters at many mats. I want to go back to the utility bills first. You are from north east, so heating involved, the reverse on the south where a/c is involved. What is the heat sources? I find if you use gas and water and washer and dryer rev without building requirements it make more sense. If I add the a/c bill to one mat it scew the utility ratio.

[Sunflower]

I'm wondering what type of energy is used there? Propane, N Gas, Electric? If it's propane or ng, have the company come out and check for leaks. There were 18 leaks (one of them was huge) when we bought ours and then they found another 5 or so later!

That might take care of some of your problem right there!

PS I am also w/these other guys. Our the prices really low?

[Palmyra Jim]

I will check the competition. I believe the mats are .25 below competition. I will talk to the owner about the prices. I am wondering if he lowered them or just didn't raise them?

I would love to replace the boilers with instant heaters. It doesn't make sense to store 300-400 gals of water for hours when only a few machines are turning.

I will definitely check for leaks. That is one thing I have done my self and it would be a good way to learn the system better.
Jim

[Silent Roo]

Yes updating the heater should lower cost. It should pay off in a couple years at most. Equipment can be the same way. Depending on the models you can also adjust cycles to 'shorten' often maytags of that flavor may have an extra rinse.

Newer machines use less in utilities however will cost you more than 2-5% of your gross to buy.

[Palmyra Jim]

Yikes!!!! By the age of my boilers, they are running at 60% efficiency. Plus I have two because one is not enough at maximum gals. per minute.

I am impressed with the response from a few distributors...Especially the 98% efficiency Hamilton Evo. If I install two new boilers and use only the one holding tank I will be able to reduce the natural gas bill by 35% at least or $14,000.00.

Brings my overall utilities down to 22%!

Thank you all you pointed the way. I am surprised the owner did not realize this!

I suppose this is where one can say the Forum will pay for itself.....

Jim

[William]

You should figure on 80% efficiency. I know they say 98% but figure on eighty...

[Palmyra Jim]

so that would suggest that 80% efficiency equiptment will give me almost my 60% that I am currently running...interesting..

Still...80% yields a pretty good savings over what I have.

Jim

[laundryboy]

No. Wrong assumption.

Williams reference to the high efficiency (98%) really being about 80%, is somewhat correct. Don't assume that an 80% rated would then be 60% efficient.

The high efficiency rate boilers/heaters are rated at ideal conditions, which don't always exist in there application. For example, you will achieve 'better' efficience if you have colder input water!

[Gatorlenny]

Raising the rates will be the biggest bang. Go up .25 on every washer. Around here dryers are 6-7 minutes per .25. Most tops I see are 2.00. Good for us!

If you are handy, order your own tankless from a seller on ebay and install it yourself. I did mine that way and have a Takagi Mobuis. That style allows me to add others if necessary. I figure I saved at least 1500 in install and eqp. Payback should be around 2-3 years.

[Palmyra Jim]

Thanks for the thoughts, Gaterlenny....

I just talked to a Takagi Mobuis dealer out of Indiana. He recommends 2 TM-199, controler unit and a remote controller.

I am wondering how many machines you have, what models you are using and if you ever run out of hot water. Apparently a couple of times a year there are waiting lines for the machine during a special event when 1000's of families visit the town. Apparently they bring bus loads to the laundry!

Moving Forward...
Jim

[Pablo]

Also check Paloma water heater. We have two hooked together. When you just need a little water only on lights, when you need more, they both light. make around 9 gallons a minute each, forever.

Paul

[Palmyra Jim]

Thanks Pablo. I looked over the Palomas. It appears all the systems are written up with many of the same specs but Paloma appears least expensive or most competitive in price. So let's hear the horror stories...the downside of these heaters. I will be converting one store immediately with 4-7 heaters to meet the water demand. I can mount them in the attic for ease of access and minimize distance to various machine groupings and them open up an additional 300 square feet for more equiptment or a pool table...*S*

Jim

PS..My wife has been complaining about hot water lately...looks like we will be installing one in our home as well.