WOW ! I ask for it

[JOY712]

Here is a rock "Here we are" Here is a hard place. Our mat is in a small town very small we pull customers from every by towns by offering 15 min dry time for .25. Their dry is 10 for .25 without the out of town customers we could not stay open.
Our washers are at the same price. We have talked to a few of the customers and they said there would be no reason to come if the dryers were the same price Does anyone know another way. Thank You JOY

[laundryboy]

I'm in NW Ohio and have columbia gas as a supplier. If you have them to, you are in real trouble. They (Columbia Gas) have been approved to raise prices in Sep and Oct, back -to- back price increases. I have three stores:

1. 6min/qtr
2. 7min/qtr - first quarter only gets you 6 mins, 7min each additional. This will soon change to a flat 6min/qtr.
3. 8min/qrt - changing to 7 min this week.

Keep you dryers clean. This is were the SpeedQueens/Huebch suck - they are hard to get clean. ADC's are great - pull the front panel and vaccum (every 4-6 months).

An effeciant dryer is a benefit to you and the customer, you will use less gas and the customer will get a quicker dry.

If you are using Dryers as the reason to come to your laundry, you need to make up for your "loss leader" in your washer price. You are basically offering free dry. When a store uses free dry to get customers in the door, their washer prices are always higher. Maybe you need to raise your wash price.

Another option, raise prices to be profitable with your local customers (your real customer base). As the price of gasoline increases, it makes it more expensive for people to drive out of your area. With this same example, you might find you will be lossing the customers that drive into your area for the same reason. I'm not going to spend an extra gallon to go and save a quarter or two.

[Anonymous]

Nothing against you as a person, but I am glad that people like you are now between a rock and a hard place. Hopefully all those like you will be forced out of business by the increase in energy costs. You have been hurting the industry for years by underpricing which is bad for our industry. All owners loose when you as an owner do stuff like this. All laundromats should price based on full costs to make a decent profit, if they did this then none of us would have the problem of having to compete against the idiots that absorb price increases and have not changed their prices in 8 years. I am sorry for you as an individual that you are getting squeezed, but we don't need your type of competition in a business where those that are charging realistic prices are feeling the hurt from energy prices.

[Westlake]

Extraplay, there are a lot of us getting squeezed and just trying to survivor. I am surrounded by 3 other mats within 1 short city block. My competition currently vends their dryers at 20 min, 15 min & 15 min. Last year I lowered by time from 15 to 13 min while my competitors where vending at 30, 20 & FREE. I saw a 20% decline in business across the board. I am about ready to go to 10 mins but can’t get any concessions from my competitors. Problem is the other mat flip ownership about every 12 months and each new owner appears to be stupider than the last. Every time I turn around someone is giving dry’s for free or vending tops at .50 cents.

And don’t give me all that crap about cleanest, brightest, most friendly mat gets the business sometimes you just got to do whatever you can to survivor. Now I agree with you that these idiots should be run out of business but in the case of JOY712 above better to make a small profit than go under.

[gdinero]

Nothing against you as a person, but I am glad that people like you are now between a rock and a hard place. Hopefully all those like you will be forced out of business by the increase in energy costs. You have been hurting the industry for years by underpricing which is bad for our industry. All owners loose when you as an owner do stuff like this. All laundromats should price based on full costs to make a decent profit, if they did this then none of us would have the problem of having to compete against the idiots that absorb price increases and have not changed their prices in 8 years. I am sorry for you as an individual that you are getting squeezed, but we don't need your type of competition in a business where those that are charging realistic prices are feeling the hurt from energy prices.

This is to the idiots who would like to see the competition ran out of business,because they can't compete or they just want to make more money then their already making.Sounds to me like you want to be the only laundromat in town.If you didn't understand the reality of competiton in business you shouldn've got into it.As for as I know they've been doing free dry and 10 min. dry for awhile now.Instead of trying to wish competition out of business you might need to adjust your business practices and worry if you are doing the right thing to stay in business,because what the competiton is doing is adjusting things so they can stay in business.When doing your research you should have adjusted for competition.I've been in business for awhile now and I am the smallest and oldest laundromat in the area and what I've noticed that you need better promotion than just free soap,10 wash free concept etc.Yes I have the reliable cutomers but for me to obtain new cutomers or to have a constant customer base I have to offer the free dry on certain days,because I've noticed only thing people love is "Free" occasionally.So,give the small guy a break their just trying to maintain a profitable business,not hurt the big business laundromat.

[Anonymous]

Think you are missing the point. The point is this business is messed up in terms of supply and demand. In many markets there are just too many laundromats. The is exacerbated by distributors that keep building new stores and offering seminars to convince new "investors" that this is a great business. There is only so much dirty clothing and the reason you have markets with very low pricing is because there are too many washing machines chasing too few clothing. Some of them need to go out of business -- this is basic economics. Sure you can come up with unique ways to compete, but that does not change the basics that the return on investment in this business has been steadily going down for quite a few years because of excess capacity.

[JOY712]

Well I asked for it and I got it Boy did I get I I am glad that people like you are now between a rock and a hard place. Hopefully all those like you will be forced out of business by the increase in energy costs. You have been hurting the industry... The few costomers I get from the two big towns Don't hurt the two store a bit . They are so few But it helps me keep my small town laundry open "PEOPLE LIKE ME "I like that . Did not realize there was so many like me I`m seeing that there is a lot of owers having trouble with the high gas price .You are right its better for me to sale out and let them put in a parking lot and then the people can go to the town up the road to do their laundry and while they are there they can shop while they get their laundry done at the big Kroger's there and will put in another parking lot Thanks for your honesty . And just think all because of my one laundry JOY

[pete f]

Here is a rock "Here we are" Here is a hard place. Our mat is in a small town very small we pull customers from every by towns by offering 15 min dry time for .25. Their dry is 10 for .25 without the out of town customers we could not stay open.
Our washers are at the same price. We have talked to a few of the customers and they said there would be no reason to come if the dryers were the same price Does anyone know another way. Thank You JOY

25 cent for 15 mins, you are not making any money.
Just lower the time to 12. Should be 7 mins. You can't go much else, people will go to the closet mat that meets their needs, a few will go the extra to get a deal. If your price does not make any money than you do not need that extra business.

[Andy]

Has anyone had experience with the 50 cents to start program?

How did it go over?

Did you use any special techniques to educate/help/inform your customers?

[Kitty]

Think you are missing the point. The point is this business is messed up in terms of supply and demand. In many markets there are just too many laundromats. The is exacerbated by distributors that keep building new stores and offering seminars to convince new "investors" that this is a great business. There is only so much dirty clothing and the reason you have markets with very low pricing is because there are too many washing machines chasing too few clothing. Some of them need to go out of business -- this is basic economics. Sure you can come up with unique ways to compete, but that does not change the basics that the return on investment in this business has been steadily going down for quite a few years because of excess capacity.


Some markets are tougher than others in regards to pricing and competition and I would guess many of these markets will see the biggest increase in store foreclosures or dumping grounds for selling the stores cheap because the owners won't be able to stand the heat?

But, when the dust settles and the market levels out again and utilites rates settle down new stores will be on the rise again because there are associations out there promoting the industry and promoting store growth.

Are there those out there in the industry wanting to manipulate the laundromat industry into the Walmart mentality and business startegies? If so, if that type of stategy opens a can of whooppass in your back yard ~ you as the small operator (and I'm talking even those of you with big pockets) can't compete with really deep pockets. I hate Walmart and I despise Blockbuster for the type of business stategy they bring to some markets. Hopefully, this is not what will happen to the laundromat industry even though I see it starting on a small scale.....

Andy look at this thread we were talking about this a month or so ago...maybe this will help? Hope all is well with you...Kitty
http://www.coinwash.com/mb/showthread.php?t=4948&highlight=marketing

[Von Hef]

Some markets are tougher than others in regards to pricing and competition and I would guess many of these markets will see the biggest increase in store foreclosures or dumping grounds for selling the stores cheap because the owners won't be able to stand the heat?

But, when the dust settles and the market levels out again and utilites rates settle down new stores will be on the rise again because there are associations out there promoting the industry and promoting store growth.

Are there those out there in the industry wanting to manipulate the laundromat industry into the Walmart mentality and business startegies? If so, if that type of stategy opens a can of whooppass in your back yard ~ you as the small operator (and I'm talking even those of you with big pockets) can't compete with really deep pockets. I hate Walmart and I despise Blockbuster for the type of business stategy they bring to some markets. Hopefully, this is not what will happen to the laundromat industry even though I see it starting on a small scale.....

Andy look at this thread we were talking about this a month or so ago...maybe this will help? Hope all is well with you...Kitty
http://www.coinwash.com/mb/showthread.php?t=4948&highlight=marketing

Some hate Walmart, others hate McDonalds, but the fact remains that the business strategy that these large corporations use is sucessful, because the customer percieves it as the best value. If you don't like Walmart (or K-Mart or Target)... then pay the higher prices down the street. If you don't like McDonalds (or Burger King or Wendy's) then buy your burger at the local Burger stand. This is capitalism and everyone votes with there dollars. My point is...don't denigrate an establishment that is supported with your cash :^)

[Kitty]

Some hate Walmart, others hate McDonalds, but the fact remains that the business strategy that these large corporations use is sucessful, because the customer percieves it as the best value. If you don't like Walmart (or K-Mart or Target)... then pay the higher prices down the street. If you don't like McDonalds (or Burger King or Wendy's) then buy your burger at the local Burger stand. This is capitalism and everyone votes with there dollars. My point is...don't denigrate an establishment that is supported with your cash :^)

Von Hef you are absolutely correct, these strategies are sucessful and the marketing to the customers perceptions is very keen. Although the startegies do not work on me, I pay higher prices at other establishments as I do not like Walmart nor the likes of the other businesses, I prefer more personal services and can see far beyond the marketing perceptions that the big corporations want customers to swallow.

I don't think we need more industries using this type of strategy in the business world whether or not this is capitalism or not. I'd say store owners need to heed that as a warning and decide where to put there own dollars and who they support.

[laundryboy]

The "Walmart" strategies will not work in the laundromat industry. The margins just aren't there. The distributor network discourages a national plan. Beariers to entry are to low. It would be hard to attract a group of investors to buy into this, especially when you look at how an operation would have to be developed.

I would encourage this type of operation. Think of the marketing they would bring to YOUR town. Would they control the market - absolutly not. But, think of all the new customers that now know to take their comforters to a LAUNDROMAT! And you did'nt spend a dime on TV/radio advertising. They would have to market to a large area that they would not be servicing - hopefully, you would pickup many of these converted customers to Drop Off Laundry Service. No, I would not want to compete directly with them.

[Kitty]

The "Walmart" strategies will not work in the laundromat industry. The margins just aren't there. The distributor network discourages a national plan. Barriers to entry are to low. It would be hard to attract a group of investors to buy into this, especially when you look at how an operation would have to be developed.

I would encourage this type of operation. Think of the marketing they would bring to YOUR town. Would they control the market - absolutely not. But, think of all the new customers that now know to take their comforters to a LAUNDROMAT! And you didn't spend a dime on TV/radio advertising. They would have to market to a large area that they would not be servicing - hopefully, you would pickup many of these converted customers to Drop Off Laundry Service. No, I would not want to compete directly with them.


Of course lets assume the Walmart strategy is used on the laundromat industry on a much smaller scale, and then of course the margin is certainly there.

However, that is really not the point the point is that there is market penetration in the densely populated fiercely competitive markets across the country in this industry (where the million dollar revenue producing stores are located) and this strategy will effect these areas and it will take away from market share from many of these operators that have spent 100,000's of 1000's of dollars but yet now comes the million + dollar operators into these markets to take the lions share.

But, throw a bone to store owners and increase popularity into the industry. Market the Laundromat business in womens magazines! A brilliant concept! I'd be taking a bite off that bone for free...

[quartercounter]

Girl,
Stores will be built and resold over and over, names and faces will change to protect the innocent. Manufacturers and distributors are in business to make money and will be selling stores if the Walmart strategy will go in certain areas why wouldn't the industry target those areas to increase their sales? You have to look at this capitalisticly and realisticly. Im a store owner I am not happy with this capitalistic attitude of the manufacturer (Il quote you I am not happy with their "market pentetration" tactics but I can understand it as I am a businessman. As a store owner I don't see myself funding the deeds that help tend the grass.

[Kitty]

Think you are missing the point. The point is this business is messed up in terms of supply and demand. In many markets there are just too many laundromats. The is exacerbated by distributors that keep building new stores and offering seminars to convince new "investors" that this is a great business. There is only so much dirty clothing and the reason you have markets with very low pricing is because there are too many washing machines chasing too few clothing. Some of them need to go out of business -- this is basic economics. Sure you can come up with unique ways to compete, but that does not change the basics that the return on investment in this business has been steadily going down for quite a few years because of excess capacity.


How many of you guys feeling the squeeze? I understand there are many areas still seeing large stores moving in the metropolitan areas densly populated in the northeast. New stores havd not had a decrease in many areas in the NYC/Chicago and many NJ areas? I'm sure this is not good news to many in these areas, especially with the increase in utilities this may have a huge effect on more store owners if deeper pockets ride into your market place.

[kbc747]

First stop advertising for your competition, when you ask any customer in any business how they would react to a price increase they are going to try to scare you or at least act defiant. Look I undeerstand you fell tis is the only reason they come but be real, whould you haul your clothes for miles to save lets save 2-3 dollars to wash your clothes. I sure wouldn't, you have them beat some where else that is big in your customers mind. Maybe go to 13 or so and play with your heat a little.

Best of luck

[MichaelCa]

Extraplay had some 'tough love' for you, but there is truth hidden in the harsh words.
I sympathize with him too - when one invests a whole lotta capital in one's business - and a competitor uses *UNDER-pricing* to keep their own business share: NOTE: i did not say Discount pricing, or good old fashioned bare-knuckled competition pricing - but below-cost pricing

Governments for the last century, & private associations long before that, have long known to kick heads of those companies (& countries) that price below-cost & "dump" goods onto other markets.
No, that is NOT what China is doing now - i'm referring to REAL goods-dumping.
Govts & co's know to go after that HARD, because that is a genuine threat to an industry by speculative interests that have ulterior motives & no interest in the sustainability of the industry.

For example, what Walmart does (and I'm neither supporting nor disparaging what they do for the sake of this thread), is provide tough, low-priced competition - BUT, they still make a profit day in & day out, as their stockholders will proudly tell you.

DOES Walmart, etc., use 'unfair' advantage ? Actually, its not really 'unfair' at all.
BUT WAIT- is there ultimately some negative impact to consumers ? - you betcha : Less competition when everyone else moves away, less cohesiveness in a downtown 'community', lower wages, strongarming city councils w/$$ or lawsuits (carrot or stick), & other social ills.

So, ultimately, WHO has to decide whether they want this or not ? The consumer - they can CHOOSE. BUT remember, consumers are greedy too (surprise! just like all humans).
Often they make decisions based on greed - (the greed to keep more money in their wallets), & this is when Walmarts, etc. win.
Same as when that ultra-low-fare carrier wins, Same as when that shiny new mat offering free dry & .50 toploads opens up next to you.

What if you're just an 'ole kindly mat using pricing from the 1980's ? - aren't you a *good* mat ?
aren't you someone who doesn't deserve the same disdain as those Cash-Rich, Brain-Cell-Poor, new mat owners ?
NOT when competition AND consumers find out where you've been hiding. Change is coming to town & you are *it*, unless you yourself change -radically.

So where can you turn to ?

There *IS* a reason for business associations:
For protection of the business market - There is nothing wrong with that - it has been done for thousands of years - Guilds in ancient Europe jealously guarded their trade.
Before that, trade rings, and even private 'customs' duties on caravan routes kept 'unfair' competition in check - by force.
It is natural for like ppl to ally themselves with others of comparable knowledge & keep uninformed speculators out.

There *is* some ruthlessness involved. A maverick may be great, or (more often) be very bad for the industry. Time & the market proves them out - the same as to a long-time owner. Not everyone can stay "in".

In a way, many of us who participate here on this board are an association, informal though it may be. Through exchange of knowledge & informed opinion we are constantly re-aligning where we see our business, and that is an important thing to do.
A positive association questions things as they are, and probes for weakness, to strengthen the majority.

"Other" (un-named) associations within our industry only exist to serve a narrower, and probably counter-productive aspect of our business.

Associations flourish where they can be *effective* against uninformed interlopers - even though at the same time all industries ultimately need those very same interlopers/mavericks/whatever you want to call them, to affect some change to the business, or else it stagnates.

The few that accomplish this only do so because of commitment to long-term success within the industry - they thrive, and that becomes the new paradigm.

--------------

YOU *must* change, or close.
If you love the business enough, re-vision it totally, re-concieve it with an entirely new model/concept.
Question why you love staying in it so much, & when you have your answer, focus on that.
Its hard to beat somebody who loves what their doing.

If you're just treading water, you already have your answer.

[Kitty]

Extraplay had some 'tough love' for you, but there is truth hidden in the harsh words.
I sympathize with him too - when one invests a whole lotta capital in one's business - and a competitor uses *UNDER-pricing* to keep their own business share: NOTE: i did not say Discount pricing, or good old fashioned bare-knuckled competition pricing - but below-cost pricing

Governments for the last century, & private associations long before that, have long known to kick heads of those companies (& countries) that price below-cost & "dump" goods onto other markets.
No, that is NOT what China is doing now - i'm referring to REAL goods-dumping.
Govts & co's know to go after that HARD, because that is a genuine threat to an industry by speculative interests that have ulterior motives & no interest in the sustainability of the industry.

For example, what Walmart does (and I'm neither supporting nor disparaging what they do for the sake of this thread), is provide tough, low-priced competition - BUT, they still make a profit day in & day out, as their stockholders will proudly tell you.

DOES Walmart, etc., use 'unfair' advantage ? Actually, its not really 'unfair' at all.
BUT WAIT- is there ultimately some negative impact to consumers ? - you betcha : Less competition when everyone else moves away, less cohesiveness in a downtown 'community', lower wages, strongarming city councils w/$$ or lawsuits (carrot or stick), & other social ills.

So, ultimately, WHO has to decide whether they want this or not ? The consumer - they can CHOOSE. BUT remember, consumers are greedy too (surprise! just like all humans).
Often they make decisions based on greed - (the greed to keep more money in their wallets), & this is when Walmarts, etc. win.
Same as when that ultra-low-fare carrier wins, Same as when that shiny new mat offering free dry & .50 toploads opens up next to you.

What if you're just an 'ole kindly mat using pricing from the 1980's ? - aren't you a *good* mat ?
aren't you someone who doesn't deserve the same disdain as those Cash-Rich, Brain-Cell-Poor, new mat owners ?
NOT when competition AND consumers find out where you've been hiding. Change is coming to town & you are *it*, unless you yourself change -radically.

So where can you turn to ?

There *IS* a reason for business associations:
For protection of the business market - There is nothing wrong with that - it has been done for thousands of years - Guilds in ancient Europe jealously guarded their trade.
Before that, trade rings, and even private 'customs' duties on caravan routes kept 'unfair' competition in check - by force.
It is natural for like ppl to ally themselves with others of comparable knowledge & keep uninformed speculators out.

There *is* some ruthlessness involved. A maverick may be great, or (more often) be very bad for the industry. Time & the market proves them out - the same as to a long-time owner. Not everyone can stay "in".

In a way, many of us who participate here on this board are an association, informal though it may be. Through exchange of knowledge & informed opinion we are constantly re-aligning where we see our business, and that is an important thing to do.
A positive association questions things as they are, and probes for weakness, to strengthen the majority.

"Other" (un-named) associations within our industry only exist to serve a narrower, and probably counter-productive aspect of our business.

Associations flourish where they can be *effective* against uninformed interlopers - even though at the same time all industries ultimately need those very same interlopers/mavericks/whatever you want to call them, to affect some change to the business, or else it stagnates.

The few that accomplish this only do so because of commitment to long-term success within the industry - they thrive, and that becomes the new paradigm.

--------------

YOU *must* change, or close.
If you love the business enough, re-vision it totally, re-concieve it with an entirely new model/concept.
Question why you love staying in it so much, & when you have your answer, focus on that.
Its hard to beat somebody who loves what their doing.

If you're just treading water, you already have your answer.


Michael CA

You said it all brilliantly...

You are my hero today how bout a high five! Hopefully you will get some of our members to listen to your thoughts on this.
Thanks for taking the time to respond.
;) Kitty

[pete f]

Extraplay had some 'tough love' for you, but there is truth hidden in the harsh words.
I sympathize with him too - when one invests a whole lotta capital in one's business - and a competitor uses *UNDER-pricing* to keep their own business share: NOTE: i did not say Discount pricing, or good old fashioned bare-knuckled competition pricing - but below-cost pricing

Governments for the last century, & private associations long before that, have long known to kick heads of those companies (& countries) that price below-cost & "dump" goods onto other markets.
No, that is NOT what China is doing now - i'm referring to REAL goods-dumping.
Govts & co's know to go after that HARD, because that is a genuine threat to an industry by speculative interests that have ulterior motives & no interest in the sustainability of the industry.

For example, what Walmart does (and I'm neither supporting nor disparaging what they do for the sake of this thread), is provide tough, low-priced competition - BUT, they still make a profit day in & day out, as their stockholders will proudly tell you.

DOES Walmart, etc., use 'unfair' advantage ? Actually, its not really 'unfair' at all.
BUT WAIT- is there ultimately some negative impact to consumers ? - you betcha : Less competition when everyone else moves away, less cohesiveness in a downtown 'community', lower wages, strongarming city councils w/$$ or lawsuits (carrot or stick), & other social ills.

So, ultimately, WHO has to decide whether they want this or not ? The consumer - they can CHOOSE. BUT remember, consumers are greedy too (surprise! just like all humans).
Often they make decisions based on greed - (the greed to keep more money in their wallets), & this is when Walmarts, etc. win.
Same as when that ultra-low-fare carrier wins, Same as when that shiny new mat offering free dry & .50 toploads opens up next to you.

What if you're just an 'ole kindly mat using pricing from the 1980's ? - aren't you a *good* mat ?
aren't you someone who doesn't deserve the same disdain as those Cash-Rich, Brain-Cell-Poor, new mat owners ?
NOT when competition AND consumers find out where you've been hiding. Change is coming to town & you are *it*, unless you yourself change -radically.

So where can you turn to ?

There *IS* a reason for business associations:
For protection of the business market - There is nothing wrong with that - it has been done for thousands of years - Guilds in ancient Europe jealously guarded their trade.
Before that, trade rings, and even private 'customs' duties on caravan routes kept 'unfair' competition in check - by force.
It is natural for like ppl to ally themselves with others of comparable knowledge & keep uninformed speculators out.

There *is* some ruthlessness involved. A maverick may be great, or (more often) be very bad for the industry. Time & the market proves them out - the same as to a long-time owner. Not everyone can stay "in".

In a way, many of us who participate here on this board are an association, informal though it may be. Through exchange of knowledge & informed opinion we are constantly re-aligning where we see our business, and that is an important thing to do.
A positive association questions things as they are, and probes for weakness, to strengthen the majority.

"Other" (un-named) associations within our industry only exist to serve a narrower, and probably counter-productive aspect of our business.

Associations flourish where they can be *effective* against uninformed interlopers - even though at the same time all industries ultimately need those very same interlopers/mavericks/whatever you want to call them, to affect some change to the business, or else it stagnates.

The few that accomplish this only do so because of commitment to long-term success within the industry - they thrive, and that becomes the new paradigm.

--------------

YOU *must* change, or close.
If you love the business enough, re-vision it totally, re-concieve it with an entirely new model/concept.
Question why you love staying in it so much, & when you have your answer, focus on that.
Its hard to beat somebody who loves what their doing.

If you're just treading water, you already have your answer.


Like man, what you write is gold, I hope coinwash add it to thier files.

[MichaelCa]

Geez, thanx you guys !

yvw Kitty - here's a Hi 5 backatcha :)

[Kitty]

Hell Pete after I read it I was thinking about a freaking award or something....Actually the post, the entire thread needs to be converted to the Editorial page so anyone lurking can read the content of this one thread!

THANKS again Michael! :)

[pete f]

Well I asked for it and I got it Boy did I get I The few costomers I get from the two big towns Don't hurt the two store a bit . They are so few But it helps me keep my small town laundry open "PEOPLE LIKE ME "I like that . Did not realize there was so many like me I`m seeing that there is a lot of owers having trouble with the high gas price .You are right its better for me to sale out and let them put in a parking lot and then the people can go to the town up the road to do their laundry and while they are there they can shop while they get their laundry done at the big Kroger's there and will put in another parking lot Thanks for your honesty . And just think all because of my one laundry JOY

Joy, just raise your prices and see what happens. It may supprise you.